Homophobia

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Re: Homophobia

Post by FootbalYouBet » Thu Jan 20, 2011 8:23 pm

Al wrote:
FootbalYouBet wrote:
Al wrote:
FootbalYouBet wrote: that anything is a fact is w according to my bible based beleifs, is that any sexual activity outside the union of one man and one woman for life, is a sin.

And your bible also says.
Let he who is without sin cast the first stone and judge not lest ye be judged
As far as this discussion\topic goes, I have cast no stones and judged no one.
If you call someone a sinner, you have judged them.
I made a post on the previous page about other things that the bible forbids yet bible quoters always ignore them...You prob missed it. Check it out
The bible says "all have sinned and come short of the glory of God" Gods word, Gods judgement, not mine.

As for your first post, I found it not relevant to this topic. No insult intended.
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Re: Homophobia

Post by FootbalYouBet » Thu Jan 20, 2011 8:28 pm

T-Bone wrote:
FootbalYouBet wrote:
T-Bone wrote:
FootbalYouBet wrote:I would vote against any church acceptance or recognition of it.

As far as society goes, "married" or not, still the same sin. So what the point of "Voting" against it. That would be like voting against society's acceptance of any sex that the bible indicates as sin. I wouldnt vote against society decriminalizing prostitution either, but thats another topic.
Well many churches have accepted it but my guess is you don't go to one of those churches. Like I said earlier you can't prove if homosexuality is right or wrong, the fact is it exists. I personally believe there is nothing wrong with it. It is a personal matter which doesn't effect me in anyway so who am I to say it is wrong. I believe we should all be so lucky to find someone that loves us for who we are. If two people of the same sex truly love each other then good for them. What I don't understand is if God created us in his own image then why does homosexuality exist in the first place, if God says it's wrong?
thats like asking, why is there murder, theivery, adultery, etc.
These things must exsist because God is capable of doing them himself and we are created in his image so that is why we are capable of these things. God does kill a lot of people in the Bible.
God has the right to do what he wants, and to tell us what not to do. God is to pass Judgement on our sins, we are not to pass judgement on each others sins. IF God does a thing, he is righteous in the doing, IF we do the same thing after he has told us not to, then we are guilty of sin.

God allowed us the capability of sin so that we could make the choice to sin or not. Sin exists because Satan exist.
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Re: Homophobia

Post by T-Bone » Thu Jan 20, 2011 9:20 pm

FootbalYouBet wrote:God has the right to do what he wants, and to tell us what not to do. God is to pass Judgement on our sins, we are not to pass judgement on each others sins. IF God does a thing, he is righteous in the doing, IF we do the same thing after he has told us not to, then we are guilty of sin.

God allowed us the capability of sin so that we could make the choice to sin or not. Sin exists because Satan exist.
A bit hypocritical, no? He creates us with faults and then blames us for being faulty. Pretty big mistake for a perfect being.

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Re: Homophobia

Post by FootbalYouBet » Thu Jan 20, 2011 10:22 pm

T-Bone wrote:
FootbalYouBet wrote:God has the right to do what he wants, and to tell us what not to do. God is to pass Judgement on our sins, we are not to pass judgement on each others sins. IF God does a thing, he is righteous in the doing, IF we do the same thing after he has told us not to, then we are guilty of sin.

God allowed us the capability of sin so that we could make the choice to sin or not. Sin exists because Satan exist.
A bit hypocritical, no? He creates us with faults and then blames us for being faulty. Pretty big mistake for a perfect being.
we had the choice not to sin.

in reponse to our choosing to sin, he sent jesus to atone for all our sins and wipe the slate clean if.....

Not gonna continue with that because its a whole other topic.
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Re: Homophobia

Post by Al » Fri Jan 21, 2011 6:37 am

FootbalYouBet wrote:
As for your first post, I found it not relevant to this topic. No insult intended.
But it is perfectly relevant.
You claim that homosexuality is wrong because the bible says so...fine, I can respect that
But the bible also says that working on the sabath is punishable by death...
Why do people quote the bible for one thing and compleatly disregard it for another?

You either follow it or not.
You dont get to say, I like this so I will follow it, I dont like that so I wont.

Come to think of it
The bible gives an exact punishment for working on the sabath... Death As far I I know it only claims that homosexuality is wrong but punishment is mentioned.(again, as far as I know)

So which is worst?

In todays society, it would be like imprisonment for lying, and allowing murders free reign

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Re: Homophobia

Post by T-Bone » Fri Jan 21, 2011 9:45 am

FootbalYouBet wrote:we had the choice not to sin.

in reponse to our choosing to sin, he sent jesus to atone for all our sins and wipe the slate clean if.....

Not gonna continue with that because its a whole other topic.
Ok, lets not get it to that and let's get back on topic. So homosexuality is wrong, suicide is debatable, the rules that Al mentioned in his first post are irrelevant and the Bible is interpretive. So how do you know your interpretation is correct and someone else's is wrong?

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Re: Homophobia

Post by FootbalYouBet » Fri Jan 21, 2011 12:24 pm

Al wrote:
FootbalYouBet wrote:
As for your first post, I found it not relevant to this topic. No insult intended.
But it is perfectly relevant.
You claim that homosexuality is wrong because the bible says so...fine, I can respect that
But the bible also says that working on the sabath is punishable by death...
Why do people quote the bible for one thing and compleatly disregard it for another?

You either follow it or not.
You dont get to say, I like this so I will follow it, I dont like that so I wont.

Come to think of it
The bible gives an exact punishment for working on the sabath... Death As far I I know it only claims that homosexuality is wrong but punishment is mentioned.(again, as far as I know)

So which is worst?

In todays society, it would be like imprisonment for lying, and allowing murders free reign
this topic is about homophobia, not whether or not homosexuality is wrong. I mention that I beleive Homosexuality is wrong because the bible tells me that. That is not to open up a whole discussion about everything else the bible says. That would be a different topic.

Each thing you quote or talk about must be examined in full context as otherwise errors occurs, as per example discussed in suicide thread.
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Re: Homophobia

Post by Al » Fri Jan 21, 2011 12:32 pm

FootbalYouBet wrote: this topic is about homophobia, not whether or not homosexuality is wrong. I mention that I beleive Homosexuality is wrong because the bible tells me that.
And I mention that people use the bible when it suits them, ignore it when it doesn't

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Re: Homophobia

Post by FootbalYouBet » Fri Jan 21, 2011 12:37 pm

T-Bone wrote:
FootbalYouBet wrote:we had the choice not to sin.

in reponse to our choosing to sin, he sent jesus to atone for all our sins and wipe the slate clean if.....

Not gonna continue with that because its a whole other topic.
Ok, lets not get it to that and let's get back on topic. So homosexuality is wrong, suicide is debatable, the rules that Al mentioned in his first post are irrelevant and the Bible is interpretive. So how do you know your interpretation is correct and someone else's is wrong?
It is a frustration that even within Christianity and the church, that there are so many different interpretations of the scriptures,hence, so many different denominations and the split between protestantism and catholicism. We are all still flawed and faillable human beings and it can't be avoided. In the end, those that choose to beleive the scriptures must choose for themselves after much prayer and thought, which interpretation to believe. Often people make the mistake of trying to bend scripture to fit what they want it to say, often by taking it out of context.

So, we come back to, I BELEIVE homosexual activity is wrong because I BELEIVE the bible says it is wrong and that such scriptures are still relevant today.
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Re: Homophobia

Post by FootbalYouBet » Fri Jan 21, 2011 12:40 pm

Al wrote:
FootbalYouBet wrote: this topic is about homophobia, not whether or not homosexuality is wrong. I mention that I beleive Homosexuality is wrong because the bible tells me that.
And I mention that people use the bible when it suits them, ignore it when it doesn't
that may be true, but its a point out of the blue.

Some people do that. Most christians do not, at least not on purpose. None of which affects the validity of why I beleive homosexual activity is a sin, and that simply believing that is not a phobia.
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Re: Homophobia

Post by T-Bone » Fri Jan 21, 2011 1:11 pm

FootbalYouBet wrote:It is a frustration that even within Christianity and the church, that there are so many different interpretations of the scriptures,hence, so many different denominations and the split between protestantism and catholicism. We are all still flawed and faillable human beings and it can't be avoided. In the end, those that choose to beleive the scriptures must choose for themselves after much prayer and thought, which interpretation to believe. Often people make the mistake of trying to bend scripture to fit what they want it to say, often by taking it out of context.

So, we come back to, I BELEIVE homosexual activity is wrong because I BELEIVE the bible says it is wrong and that such scriptures are still relevant today.
Yup we have come full circle, not much more to say. To conclude, you are free to believe your heterosexist belief but you can't prove homosexuality is right or wrong. It's a personal matter for each individual to deal with themselves.

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Re: Homophobia

Post by Dave in Korea » Fri Jan 21, 2011 3:39 pm

FootbalYouBet wrote:
Al wrote:
FootbalYouBet wrote: this topic is about homophobia, not whether or not homosexuality is wrong. I mention that I beleive Homosexuality is wrong because the bible tells me that.
And I mention that people use the bible when it suits them, ignore it when it doesn't
that may be true, but its a point out of the blue.

Some people do that. Most christians do not, at least not on purpose. None of which affects the validity of why I beleive homosexual activity is a sin, and that simply believing that is not a phobia.
But if one is a homophobe, then he/she is likely to interpret the Bible the same way you do, in order to match his own biases/fears . . . so it can be a bit of a chicken-and-egg deal.

And if you want to get into the interpretation game, then the word phobia can certainly be interpreted to apply to any sort of aversion to anything, including homosexuality.
Last edited by Dave in Korea on Fri Jan 21, 2011 3:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Homophobia

Post by FootbalYouBet » Fri Jan 21, 2011 3:43 pm

T-Bone wrote:
FootbalYouBet wrote:It is a frustration that even within Christianity and the church, that there are so many different interpretations of the scriptures,hence, so many different denominations and the split between protestantism and catholicism. We are all still flawed and faillable human beings and it can't be avoided. In the end, those that choose to beleive the scriptures must choose for themselves after much prayer and thought, which interpretation to believe. Often people make the mistake of trying to bend scripture to fit what they want it to say, often by taking it out of context.

So, we come back to, I BELEIVE homosexual activity is wrong because I BELEIVE the bible says it is wrong and that such scriptures are still relevant today.
Yup we have come full circle, not much more to say. To conclude, you are free to believe your heterosexist belief but you can't prove homosexuality is right or wrong. It's a personal matter for each individual to deal with themselves.
nice try, but there is no discrimination in my belief on this subject. Using an equally offensive word doesnt not make it valid. The word sounds innocent at first glance, but the discription is way off base to every thing I have been saying on this topic. We have come full circle, yet you have not heard me.
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Re: Homophobia

Post by T-Bone » Fri Jan 21, 2011 4:41 pm

FootbalYouBet wrote:nice try, but there is no discrimination in my belief on this subject. Using an equally offensive word doesnt not make it valid. The word sounds innocent at first glance, but the discription is way off base to every thing I have been saying on this topic. We have come full circle, yet you have not heard me.
I heard you. You don't like being called a homophobe because you are not afriad of homosexuals but you obviously don't understand the definition of discrimination. You're free to believe whatever you want, I believe I can fly but it doesn't make it so. Even Gerry who was defending your right to believe homosexuality is wrong knows that your belief is discriminatory. Just because you don't infringe on others rights (which I'm glad to hear you don't by the way) doesn't mean you are not discriminating.

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Re: Homophobia

Post by Al » Fri Jan 21, 2011 5:29 pm

FootbalYouBet wrote:
Al wrote: And I mention that people use the bible when it suits them, ignore it when it doesn't
that may be true, but its a point out of the blue.
it is not out of the blue...it directly responds to your point that it is wrong because the bible says its wrong
We do a lot of things that the bible says is wrong but you dont see anyone quoting the bible over it
FootbalYouBet wrote: Some people do that. Most christians do not, at least not on purpose.
Actually all Christians do it.
When was the last time you heard of someone being put to death because they worked a sabath? Ask a christian what they think and they will all tell you it is wrong...even though the bible demandes it

Go offer to buy a christians daughter as a slave and see how fast they call the police...but the bible says its OK

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